"Qanset" wrote in message
news:473987bf$0$19803$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
> PTravel wrote:
>>
>> "Qanset" wrote in message
>> news:4732e3b6$0$28659$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
>>> The wife and I are planning at trip to USA/Canada in the near future.
>>> Is it true that the Yanks are really hung up on tipping, and that
>>> FORGETTING to tip someone is courting disaster???
>>>
>>> Like most tourists we will be traveling on a limited budget,this means
>>> that anybody expecting free money from us will be advised to look
>>> elsewhere.
>>
>> With all due respect, I'd suggest you don't come.
>
> Bit late for that, I was there 20 years ago. I saw a peurto rican
> waitress get hostile because a British Visitor forgot to leave her a tip
> on the table. Her conduct was absolutely disgraceful.
And what's your point? You are aware, however, that there are approximately
300 million people in the U.S. and, as far as I know, we're not represented
by a Puerto Rican waitress who you encountered 20 years ago.
>
>
> When I travel
>> internationally, I buy a guidebook and learn what particular practices
>> and customs are observed in the locality I'm visiting. I don't make
>> judgments about them, and definitely do not arrive with a, "we're
>> superior because we don't do things this way," attitude. I also don't
>> insist that locals observe my customs.
>>
>> I don't think you will enjoy international travel,
>
> Wrong again. Have travelled to Twenty countries in the last 30 years
Then you should know better. Perhaps you're one of those unfortunates that
I run into from time to time, complaining how nothing is like it is at home.
I've posted these before, but I'll do it again. There are three rules I
follow when I travel internationally (and I've been traveling much longer
than you and to far more places):
1. Always remember you're a guest in someone else's country. Act like a
guest and respect the customs, preferences and practices of your hosts.
2. If in doubt, ask rather than assume -- I'd rather appear naive than rude
and offensive.
3. Err on the side of generosity -- it is better to pay too much than too
little, tip high rather than low, etc.
You've violated all three rules and, as a result, you've already offended a
number of Americans and you haven't even gotten here yet.
>
> and I certainly don't
>> think you'll enjoy the U.S. Everyone will probably be better off if you
>> just stay home.
>>
>>>
>>> A colleague of mine who honeymooned in Hawaii was told by a tour bus
>>> operator, that he EXPECTED gratuities for his efforts, because his job
>>> was poorly paid. What more can I say.???
>>
>> I think you've said quite enough. Incidentally, being sheparded around
>> on a tour bus is probably the worst way to visit a foreign county.
>
> Yes and No. Tours offer a tourist with no local knowledge to see sights
> with guidance of a professional tour guide. They tend to lack flexibility
> sometimes, but can be good value for others.
Bus tours offer a tourist the opportunity to be completely isolated from the
culture that they're supposedly there to experience. If all you want to do
when you travel is "see sights" then, by all means, take a bus tour. That
is, certainly, why some people travel but you won't come away with any
understanding of the people or the cultural aesthetic of the country that
you've come to visit.
>>
>>>
>>> I'm going to cop a lot of flak on this subject, but never mind I have
>>> and open mind on accepting advice on World Travel.
>>
>> Advice given: change your attitude or stay home.
>
> No way. My wife and I have strict moral guidelines for tipping. we will
> NOT be bullied, coerced or manipulated in any way to part with our hard
> earned money. From time to time we will offer tips at our own discretion
> and we will be answereable to our own conscience and judgment if we
> refuse.
I'm curious. Have you ever visited a strict Muslim country? When you do,
does your wife dress modestly, or do your strict moral guidelines preclude
respecting someone else's beliefs and customs? Have you ever been to
France? Do you always say, "bonjour" to the shopkeeper when you enter a
shop, or do your strict moral guidelines preclude honoring one of the most
fundamental tenets of courtesy in a French society? Have you ever been to
China or Japan? When you go and someone offers you a business card, do your
strict moral guidelines require that you just stuff it in your pocket or do
you take it with both hands and read it politely, so as not to give offense?
Ever been to Italy? Do your strict moral guidelines allow you to wear
shorts and your wife to wear sleeveless dresses when you visit the great
cathedrals?
I'm very curious about your "strict moral guidelines." What is the source
of a morality that says being disrespectful and judgmental when you're a
guest in another culture is acceptable?
>
> I do understand that Americans depending on tips have been disadvantaged
> by substandard work practices by their employers. Having been down that
> road previously, I earnestly suggest they find a job where they DONT rely
> on tips.
You don't understand anything about American workers who depend on tips. I
earnestly suggest that, rather than project your values and beliefs on the
rest of the world, you accept that other cultures have different values and
beliefs that, frequently, may conflict with your own.
>
> You and the rest of
>> the world will be a lot happier.
>
> Always been happy wherever I go O/S. As the for the rest of the world
> they wont even know who I am.
Oh, but they will -- they will know you as the "rude [I'm going to guess
from your screen name] Australian." And for those foreigners who have had
limited contact with Australians, they will judge Australia and all
Australians by your actions. Like it or not, we are all de facto
ambassadors for our countries when we travel internationally. By
deliberately ignoring the customs and practices of the countries that you
visit, you are setting a very poor example for your own and one by which
your fellow countrymen will be judged.
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