On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:29:31 +0930, "John H"
wrote in <46f317da_4@news.chariot.net.au>
:
>Kangaroo216 stated
I don't know who kangaroo216 might be if the pseudonym
exists at all. I post as kangaroo16 :-)
>(1) "but US voltage is a nominal 110-220 volts"
>Since when?
>I have never known any supply to fluctuate that much!
>I think you may mean 110 -120 volts
You are right, of course! I should proofread my posts rather
than just spell checking them.
As you probably know, though, A.C. voltages are usually given
in RMS [Root Mean Square] values rather than peak to peak.
The variation in RMS values depends on the tapping on the pole
transformer, and how far the consumer is from the nearest
one. There are conductor losses and other factors.
Of course, had you proofread yours, or included my post in your
reply, or checked the full headers, you wouldn't have made the
kangaroo216 error :-)
>
>(2) " in US"
>I think YOU mean AUST.
Dunno what you are referring to, which is a good argument for
not censoring the senders post. After all, plenty of bandwidth
these days, and it makes replies a lot easier for all concerned.
I usually don't snip the senders post in a reply, but sometimes I
do. When I do, I note that the post is snipped and the reader
is referred to the original.
>
>(3) "It might be more convenient
>and probably cheaper to buy one in the USA".
>Using your vernacular, maybe "probably",
>but would depend on many factors such as store at which purchased,
>whether it was on sale etc. all which are actually about as relevant as your
>statement.
Actually, was thinking more along the lines of simple
availability. Most tourists and travelers take a lot of photos
on a trip and don't want to be caught with a "dead" electronic
camera.
Could you guarantee that someone landing at Cairns international
airport on a Sunday afternoon could easily get a recharger? Have
been to Cairns by road, not by air, so admit I really don't
know.
>
>(4) "Some tourists seem to assume that an "adaptor" plug changes the
>> voltage, which it doesn't.
>Conjecture on your part!
Do try to be more clear in your replies! Most adaptor plugs just
provide a match between physical plug and socket. I don't doubt
that some adaptors consist of a transformer with a plug for the
Australian sockets and a U.S. two pin socket. Have one as a
matter of fact.
>
>(5) "Make sure the power supply on the
>> appliance you intend to use has a switch to change the voltage
>> from 240 volts to 120 volts, and remember to switch to proper
>> voltage before plugging it in!
Think that this is a fair warning, as have heard of cases where
the tourist or traveler did exactly that.
>AND (6)
>> So what if Janet's charger doesn't have a voltage change switch?
>> In that case, she would have to find an adapter that includes a
>> transformer, or buy a 240 volt charger to charge her batteries at
>> the proper low voltage and polarity.
>
>Lots of appliances are nowadays "multi" voltage and will cover from
>110v to 240v and 50 - 60 Hz without any voltage or frequency switch of any
>kind.
>Laptops are one that "springs to mind" as mine does exactly that.
>My battery charger for the digital camera does, and also has the ability to
>have the plug slide
>off the back of the unit and another countries plug slid in to replace it
>and no other "transformer " or anything else needed.
"Lots" doesn't mean "all".:-)
>
>Your answer would only apply if her appliance was of an earlier vintage that
>would only work on 110 volts,
>thus need a 240v to 110v step down device, usually (but not always) a
>transformer.
How do we know from her original post just what she has?
>+++
>
>Frequency difference (50Hz to 60Hz) on a small charger would have negligible
>effect,
>perhaps slight heating of the unit depending upon whether it is has a wound
>transformer in unit .
True, but not important from a safety aspect.
>The Earth pin may or may not be longer, The standard states 1.63 mm for all
>of them,
>some supplied are same length and some slightly longer, in fact some are
>actually larger in height
>and width ie 15 amp socket, where earth pin is same length, wider,
>and higher, so they wont fit into the standard 10 amp socket,
>but the standard 10 amp plug will fit into a 15 amp socket.
Perhaps most of my small appliances are obsolescent, then, as
most have a longer earth pin. Presumably the reason for this is
that the earth ["ground" in US] connection is established before
the active and neutral prongs reach the contacts.
>
>>There is also a 20 Amp plug & socket, where all pins are wider (thicker),
>but rarely ever seen by 90% of population, never seen in domestic premises
>AFAIK.
Depending on how you define "domestic premises" of course. Would
you define a farm shop as a part of a "domestic premise"? Some
do have 20 amp outlets, though will agree that 15 amp are
probably more common.
If we ignore other technical terms such as power factor,
conductor resistance, etc. a 20 amp socket at 220 volts will
theoretically provide 4,400 watts. At a line voltage of
240 volts, 4,800 watts.
A 15 amp outlet at 220 volts would provide 3,300 watts,
and at 240, 3,600 watts.
Want to dispute this? :-)
>Also most small appliances do not even have the 3rd (earth pin) anyway as
>they are invariably double insulated.
>No double insulated appliance has to have the 3rd (earth) pin, but here
>again some are supplied with plug that has it.
I might quibble about the "invariably", but would agree with the
rest of your statement.
However, I'm more concerned with safety than what is available,
or what a tourist or migrant might be trying to use.
The US system doesn't automatically provide a true earth
connection. With only two pins, and two conductors, whether a
given conductor is active or neutral depends on which way the
user plugs it in. A cheap, but not safe, way to do it, IMHO.
At one time, a lot of American mains operated valve ["tube" in
US] radios didn't have a transformer. They relied on using
valves of different voltage ratings in series. [ Can list some
typical valve types if you wish. ] They were once prohibited
imports on the grounds of safety.
They typically used a "chassis" ground, and relied on plastic
knobs, etc. to protect the user from the shaft of volume or
tuning knobs which were often at chassis potential.
O.K., what happens if the knob is missing, and the bare
shaft is exposed? What happens if the user is washing dishes and
touches that bare shaft?
Well, it depends on how the radio was plugged in. One way, and
the chassis is at neutral potential. Put the plug in the other
and the chassis is at "active" potential and they provide a path
to true earth ground.
I assume you know that even at a mere 110 volts from arm to arm
can provide a potentially lethal 10 milliamps to the heart. To
quote a bit from a book at hand "Australian Electrical Wiring:
Theory and Practice" by K Pethbridge and W.Williams, ISBN
0 07 93407 x. [In your local library you might find a copy under
Dewey Decimal Classification 621.31924, or you could always
request a copy on interlibrary loan if you want to dispute an
issue. :-)
On page 25 of my copy, chapter 2, "Electrical Safety"
------------------
"2.1 Effects of electric current on the human body
Electric shocks due to the use of electrical equipment occur
without warning and are often serious. The average worker is
frequently involved in a dangerous situations though not
realising that voltages as low as 32 V a.c. and 115 V d.c. can be
just as lethal as much higher voltages.
There are three ways by which electric shock may be directly
fatal. The following considerations refer to 50 Hz a.c. shock to
a normal, healthy, adult male."
No need to go into details, but if anyone is curious, they are
respiratory arrest, asphyxia, and ventricular fibrillation.
Naturally, there are a lot of variables...
>but it is not wired/terminated as the cable to it is only two core anyway.
Agreed
>See same url but another page ie
>> http://www.accesscomms.com.au/Reference/AustMainsPlugVariants.htm <
>+++
>The url I supplied showed poster what it looked like a damn sight more than
>your "stick drawing",
Well, actually I usually respond to posts line by line and
hadn't even read your reference when wrote my reply.
Easier and quicker just to give a rough illustration which most
people would understand. You could be an exception, of course
:-)
Some people read posts offline, and I thought my illustration
should be adequate.
>and they would surely know what their own plug looked like.
Has the average American ever seen an Australian 3 pin plug on an
appliance?
>BTW Do you always nitpick things others say? What was given was basically
>all the person needed to know,
>using her post as the basis for the reply.
When people criticise or get "nitpicky" with me, I can and often
do reply in kind. For someone claiming that I posted under the
nym of kangaroo216 you would seem to qualify. :-)
>The poster didnt even elaborate other than to say it was a charger unit for
>a camera.
When people are posting info on the group it does help to be
explicit as to details.
>viz.
>> I would agree with the "should be able to", but that doesn't mean
>> you actually "will be able to" :-) It might be more convenient
>> and probably cheaper to buy one in the USA.
>+++
>Whilst the rest of your reply to Janet was very informative, it was not
>anything the poster asked about,
>Hell! I wonder what your reply to, a child who asked the question :"where do
>I come from" would be?
Well, my wife and I don't have kids, by choice. If talking to
some other kid, I would probably be diplomatic and untruthful and
simply say "ask your parents".
Were I to be completely truthful, could always tell him or her
that they were probably an accident due to failure of the
contraceptive methods used. :-)
Do you believe that all children are "planned"? ...A very
optimistic and unrealistic view, IMHO.
Take a look at abortion statistics for any country. Check the
subject of "abortion" on
http://www.nationmaster.com/index.php
Or better yet,
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_abo-health-abortions
On second thought, will save you a bit of research. Of the top
19, Russia ranks #1, the USA #2. Australia doesn't make the
list, but I suspect we have much better . education here.
In addition, "condoms" or "rubbers" are sold in supermarkets, and
most Australians wouldn't even raise an eyebrow at a 12 or 13
year old kid buying them, although the legal age of consent is
16 in most states.
Should a girl prefer the pill, we also have a free Medicare
system here, and kids can get their own Medicare card if
desired.
For privacy reasons, it is up to the physician, and he or she
cannot legally involve the parents.
Sorry if this information shocks you or other readers, but I
thought I should let readers know what living in a truly free
country involves. :-)
>A diatribe on the reproductive systems of both male and female, which would
>naturally be totally overkill.
Sorry about that, I believe in telling the truth to adults.
>
>Perhaps you should jump back into your Joeys pouch.
Were I actually a "joey" I might be tempted to jump back
into the pouch of "mother kangaroo" rather than get hassled when
I post on the net.:-)
It is intended for the free exchange of information worldwide,
but perhaps you haven't realized this yet.
Will you, or others on the group bother to check on the
"nationmaster" links?
Perhaps they think that pregnant women only consider abortion
if they have been forcibly .d?
Easy enough to check on the "." statistics, no?
In your opinion, is abortion preferable to infanticide?
Looking forward to your reply to issues raised in this post.
Those who aren't interested in such issues are not required
to read my posts. :-)
>
>John H
>
>"kangaroo16" wrote in message
>news:mmo5f3l486ckdlp68k2n43nqal484opel6@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:28:45 +0930, "John H"
>> wrote in
>> <46f228a3$1_1@news.chariot.net.au> :
Ah, then you DID know that I was kangaroo16. Am not used to
"top posts". Why not reply to questions and statements line by
line?
>>
>>>Hi Janet,
>>>Cairns like rest of Australia is 240 volts US is 110 volts.
>>>SO if your appliance is shown as multi voltage ie 110 - 240 then all you
>>>will need is an adapter plug to go from US two round pin horizontally in
>>>line TO the Australian 3 pin.
>>
>> Essentially correct, but US voltage is a nominal 110-220 volts
>> RMS at 60 Hertz [ cycle] , and uses a non polarized plug with
>> two vertical flat pins.
>>
>> | |
>>
>> Australia is a nominal 220-240 volt, 50 Hertz, uses a three pin
>> polarized plug with two angled flat plugs for active and neutral,
>> and a longer flat pin for a safety earth or "ground" in US.
>>
>> / \
>>
>> |
>>>Lots of chargers are multi voltage so you may indeed be OK for the voltage
>>>situation
>>>Have a look at this site for the plug shape
>>>> http://www.accesscomms.com.au/Reference/powerplug.htm <
>>>If you cant buy an adaptor in US then you should be able to buy one in
>>>Cairns (at least at the airport if not the town).regards
>>>John H
>>
>> I would agree with the "should be able to", but that doesn't mean
>> you actually "will be able to" :-) It might be more convenient
>> and probably cheaper to buy one in the USA.
>>
>> Some tourists seem to assume that an "adaptor" plug changes the
>> voltage, which it doesn't. Make sure the power supply on the
>> appliance you intend to use has a switch to change the voltage
>> from 240 volts to 120 volts, and remember to switch to proper
>> voltage before plugging it in!
>>
>> Have heard of tourists forgetting to switch an electric razor to
>> the 220-240 volt range then trying to use it. The results can
>> be both spectacular and hazardous.
>>
>> Admittedly, this probably happens more often when someone
>> assumes the voltage is the same in Australia and the US and
>> simply bends the blades of a US appliance at an angle to fit
>> an Australian outlet. This is not advisable.
>>
>> So what if Janet's charger doesn't have a voltage change switch?
>> In that case, she would have to find an adapter that includes a
>> transformer, or buy a 240 volt charger to charge her batteries at
>> the proper low voltage and polarity.
>>
>> Am sure if she takes her charger down to a camera store in the
>> USA, or checks the net, she can get more info.
>>
>> I don't expect that US tourists would bring a portable TV set on
>> a trip, but if so, it won't work in Australia. The US uses the
>> obsolete NTSC standard rather than PAL used here. Channel
>> allocations are also different.
>>
>> If bringing a mobile phone, they should check if it will work
>> here.
>>
>> Incidentally, on a different topic, currency rates constantly
>> change. Radio news at 7.08 AM here says that due to loss of
>> value in US$ it is on a par with Canadian dollar for the first
>> time in 30 years. As to Aussie dollar:
>>
>> At the moment
>> Live rates at 2007.09.20 21:13:37 UTC
>> 1.00 USD 1.16020 AUD
>> United States Dollars Australia Dollars
>> 1 USD = 1.16020 AUD 1 AUD = 0.861921 USD
>> http://www.xe.com/ucc/convert.cgi
At time that actually am finishing this post in my spare time:
1.15635 AUD=United States Dollars
1 USD = 1.15635 AUD 1 AUD = 0.864790 USD
Live rates at 2007.09.22 05:00:21 UTC
1.00 USD = 0.00136836 XAU
United States Dollars Gold Ounces
1 USD = 0.00136836 XAU 1 XAU = 730.800 USD
Again, if you or other readers are curious about current rates:
http://www.xe.com/ucc/convert.cgi
3:10 pm, or 1530 Saturday here, so cannot offer any info local
stock markets.
Looking forward to your reply.
Cheers,
Kangaroo16
To repeat: Kangaroo16:-)
=
>>
>> Cheers,
>> kangaroo16
>> [I usually post on misc.immigration Australia+ NZ.]
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>"Janet Wilder" wrote in message
>>>news:024d4d12$0$15775$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
>>>> Will I need an electricity adapter in Cairns and at Ayers Rock to plug
>>>> in
>>>> my battery charger for the rechargeable batteries for my camera? The
>>>> charger is United States-flavor electric.
>>>>
>>>> TIA
>>>> --
>>>> Janet Wilder
>>>> Bad spelling. Bad punctuation
>>>> Good Friends. Good Life
>>>
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